Nature writes,
Hi Steve… This winter I have been selling dogs on the side of the road and have been doing pretty good…. BUT… two weeks from now I have my first BIG BIG event 10-15,000 people ..really.
Promoters are saying 20k people but we all know they lie..lol Anyway is there any “formula” that one uses to know just how much food to have? This is a Jazz fest and the weather should be great. Just doing dogs and Brats.
There are 3 other food vendors one who sells greek food and two “consessions” . I will be the only one of my type. I have lots of big events planned this summer but I’m nervous about my first.
Please throw this out for help. I dont want to run outa food or have way to much.
Thanks,
Nature
++++++++++++++++++++++++
Hi Nature,
A good rule of thumb is to estimate that you’ll sell to 4% of the gate (the number of attendees). This can vary wildly of course but it’s a great place to start. Be sure to take into account weather, if there will be other vendors selling the same product as you, etc.
Also keep a notebook and record the details of each festival that you work. Record sales, entry fees, attendance, dates, weather, etc. Then next year you will have some really solid info to refer to.
How about you, slingers? What formulas or strategies do you use to plan for big events? Share them in the comments!
-Steve
The first thing to realize is that you can’t serve 20k dogs by yourself so assume you have say 4 people helping you what would be the most you can physically serve in 1 hour. I would speculate with 4 people 3 would serve while 1 would be continually preping. If each person can serve say 3 dogs in a minute that would be rouned up to 600 dogs an hour. Since you know your flow won’t be that consistant this would be a good average to go by. So if the event is 10 hrs long I would take about 6000 at a minimum and adjust accordingly to the number of people u have commited to you plus a cushion of about 5-10 pct just to be safe. Good luck I hope you do well
everyone should know thier DPH.
another point for good cart layout.
This doesn’t have to do with the question, but just wanted to throw this in. If you’re like me and been following this site with the idea of getting into the biz, this was my experience. I ordered the plans for the E-Z Hot Dog cart on friday afternoon about 3:00 thru this site. I recieved them the NEXT day by priority mail. Now that’s service. If only everyone gave that kind of service. So if you’ve been thinking about taking the jump, depending on where you live, you could be looking over your new plans in less than 24 hrs.
Nature,
I use the 4% rule. I do not know why but, it seems to work. I take the Attendance Estimate and multiply the Number by 4%. If the Venue will see 15,000 Attendance, count on selling 600 Hot Dogs. I don’t know why but this works for me. I did three parades this past week. Because of inclimate weather at my estimate was off but I had a Real nice Day Today and My figuires were right on. The Easton Parade had about 7000 and I sold 268 Hot Dogs. I brought 350. I have another parade this weekend in Stroudsburg for about the same numbers.
I like to run my inventory tight and I feel that sometimes it is better to run out before closing time than it is to have excess inventory. Many Festivals have strict rules to stay until the festival is over so make sure you have a Back-Up Inventory. Every Festival is different and you have to play it by ear.
Like I said there is really no rhyme or reason except that I did the math at past events and that is how I arrived a 4% It works for me kinda like Global Warming works for Al Gore .
Good Luck and Pay Attention to your own numbers
Ed says 6000.
Pocono says .04 x 15,000 = 600.
I feel a lively discussion about to take place… 🙂
-Steve
J Collins – no problem. I know when I order something I want it right away too. Glad to help!
-Steve
Ed’s comments could be close if you are the only food vendor. I can guarntee you won.t be. I plan on an estimate in the 4-5 % range and more on the conservitive side unless you are using product the next day elsewhere. Just keep good records on amounts of product, what sold best, weather etc.
we did our 1st show about 8 months ago and I had no clue as well, we sold out in a 4 hour time span, now I bring 3 cooloers full of dogs and sausages, yes I do run out but think of it this way, you can only make so much at a show,
As a past fireman, the # 1 rule is bring what ever you can, keep plenty of ice on hand and what every you dont sell bring back and store in the frig. I always sell out thou.
Tony
In my experience the more important question is the science. A lot depends on your equipment. And how long it takes to cook product with that equipment. As an example, It takes about 4 minutes to steam product to temp on my cart. It takes about 2 minutes to boil product to temp on my rig. So you would automatically assume you should then just boil product, but it’s not that simple. When I steam, the water stays at temperature longer than when I boil. Also, if the product is frozen and you put a big ice block of meat in the water, it (the water) immediately stops boiling. So it takes even longer.
Generally speaking, most carts are not engineered for volume, and I KNOW I can’t cook 6,000 units of anything in one day. In fact 600 would be a stretch if it’s frozen. I would need something cooking on the side by something other than my cart to support larger numbers.
The larger the amount of expected units also requires a larger amount of labor, and therefore labor costs as well…
Just out of curiosity, take a poll and ask how many hotdogs everyone can cook “from their cart only” in a day (say 10 hours just to have a number), and how they “science” it. I think many would be surprised at how much the number would decline in each successive hour. Especially if it’s frozen product.
Good point – a steamer stays hot all the time.
This is s complete. Different. Subject. A week or so ago you mentioned. Serving breakfast. Can you tell me how that is done on a hot dog cart
https://hotdogprofits.com/blog/breakfast-at-the-hot-dog-cart/
Bob – Great point. Recordkeeping is essential unless you like reinventing the wheel all the time.
Thanks for your input!
-Steve
I normally go by the storage space that I have, I have had some big events and yes I sold out but if your operation is as small as mine; selling out is great. The first big event I sold out and was allowed to close my cart down earily but the second event I wanted to close but the event said I could not close. If you don’t have the help to serve you can not put out enought good products were it will matter at all. Always remember the weather, it was scheduled to rain and did not, then it rained and was not scheduled, go figure. You may think that you are going to be the only hotdogger there but don’t count on it. I had a friend on my right at the first event with his 40 foot food trailer with hotdogs, hamburgers, bar-b-q, funnel cake, and everything else you can think of, my dogs were $2 and his were $2, I sold out in 3 hours and he sold out in 3 hours, go figure that. Don’t let other vendors around you scare you, run your operation and they will come. One last thing, you can always bring stuff home but buns normally can not last as long as other products. Try and have a back up event or a normal sale location to get rid of extra stock.
Duggs Doggs
That is a good idea, thanks
I use a very simple but accurate formula for my own numbers. On average, 1 out of 3 passersbys will score you a vend. So it depends where you’re located at the event. I like to be right at the entrance…every attendee passes you coming and going. Don’t forget…you are selling the number one street food product in America! Every has had and will continue to have a good ‘ol hotdog. Make it a great day!!!!!
4% will work for the first event, but murphy is always out there. The first one is always fun but keep records and next year will be better.I have events thur the year and always take extra. The left overs go into the refer for my week day spot.
Send in a report about the event and maybe steve will print it,
L:ots of luck
Rick
Weather is not a problem – i’m in Arizona and they are predicting 80 degrees. The promoter sent an e-mail with what is being served 1 “consession” is bbq the other is burgers and fried stuff. The othere is greek food and one “sweet” booth. You must stay till the end of the event. The event is 10 hrs the first day and 12 hours the second day. I put in an order for 600+ buns with my vendor. Not to worried about extra dogs. Good news is Sam’s club is 2 miles away for dogs and stuff. All my brats are made special by a “pork Place” thats what I can’t just pick up if needed. Now I’m asking How much is too much and change???? 400.00 enough? I have two Victor carts one for a back up if something should break. So a good cart is not a Problem. I only take one with me at a time. I will keep track of my first event very close and report in. Your all really great. I have 3 on my cart. I serve, shell takes money and my daughter gives out chips and drinks and keeps the condiments full and clean. Only 7 more days to the event!
I have to tell ya … I’ve been lurking around several different forums learning what I can and never really contributing. With this topic as a perfect example I must say that this group by far offers the most valuable (and honest) info of any. THANKS everyone!!!
Hope you do well at your first big event. We are having trouble getting into ANY events. Any suggestions would be great.
Janet
Janet,
I’ve only been slinging about three months and have quite a few events lined up. Here’s what I did. I started looking for events really early (in the off season, if you will). Google festivals/fairs in your area. Several festival locator sites/services will pop up. Look at ALL of them. They’ll give you “teaser” information and then want a fee for more info. You DON’T have to pay that fee. Simply take the name of the festival and then Google that. That usually will put you in direct touch with the promoting entity. Even if the information is from last year or a season that just ended, it is still good. Also here’s something a little bit ‘out of the box’. Check with local JROTC programs at your area high schools. They usually participate in drill competitions that attract a lot of people. And there’s usually no food vendors there…but lots of hungry high schoolers and their parents.
Papa George
Great tips! Thanks for sharing.
Hi Janet, the only suggestion is persistence. If the first event you try and fail then try the next one. Eventually you will get to the correct person and will get a positive response. NEVER GIVE UP!
My wife and I came back from a big event a couple weeks ago in Daytona Beach Fl. and we were expecting to do really good. I stocked up on everything to last 9 days. Needless to say we crashed and burned, the weather was cold and rainy now I’m trying to find a location in my own area to sell which is really tough. Good Luck!
We have taken our cart for the past three years to the Sturgis Bike Rally. I rent a refridgerated trailer to store plenty of extra hot dogs, Italian Beef, etc. But I go to event like that expectinf to sell out cause you could never have enought to satisfy that many people. The first two years I felt shame and embarassement for not having enough product and stresses trying to get more there. Now we do what we can and try to anticipate the crowd. My advise… do what you can, and go home a happy hot dogger. Best wishes and have a great time… we do!
This is my first year in food vending. I’m going to Stugis rally. Not sure how much food to bring?
Where can I rent a refrigerated/freezer cart near Sturgis?
Hey mike was that event the ballon fest in new smyrna? I was there and it was a total crash. Floridians don’t come out in sleet.
This particular post was meant to focus in on ways to calculate inventory needs for larger events, and we got some good info. Thanks to everyone who replied.
An unexpected bonus was that it succeeded in uncovering a larger topic that Mary, Dave, Nature, Janet, Renee, and many others want to discuss – namely how to do fairs and festivals in general.
I hear you. Stay tuned… I’ve got something up my sleeve.
For now I want to keep this article on-topic regarding inventory estimating methods.
I love your enthusiasm everyone!!!
-Steve
Nobody ever ask this question, what is the best type of chair to have when you vending?
Thanks
John Jackson
Hopefully you never have enough time to sit and relax XD
True!
Susie and I say – take as much as your vehicle will hold – we did 3 days in Fountain Hills – AZ – that Ford was packed!!!! Great thoughts, thank you all! Sue and Rena!
Thanks to all:
My opening day for Dogs on the Run is a local event called Thunder over Louisville an estimated 1,000,000 people on both side of the Ohio River (no joke, Goggle it), so talk about nervous. But after reading everyones input, hopefully I am prepared as much as I can be. Thanks Bill @ Dozer Dogz ” do what you can and go home a Happy Hot Dogger”. Any handy ideas on ice storage (beside ice chests). There is an Ice Vender at the event but cost is high.
Good Luch Nature!!!
Tim, I,m from KY also and love the thunder How did the event go.
I did several “big events” last year and have even more lined up for this season. The 4% rule is a good one. I take the estimated attendance figure and divide it in half. I then divide that number by the number of vendors and that usually gets close. The main thing to remember is to keep your booth VERY CLEAN! A large number of customers comment on how clean our booth is and that’s why they chose us. Also, bear in mind that during the latter hours of the festival, sales will drop some.
John J,
When there is Money at Hand You must constantly Stand, after you Quit there be time to Sit….
There must be some type of formula. Having worked in restaurant management for 13 years we worked with history when making orders jor predicting sales. take as much as you can bring isn’t a formula. The 4% rule seems to be a formula or if you worked the festival in the past and sold x amount. just my opinion.
Tim,
I have an execellent recipe for Ice if you need it!–
Seriously Tim, I have a Pick-up and I put in Two Plastic Tool Bins that amazingly insulate the Ice. I can Fit 500 Pounds of Ice and it will stay cold until it melts..No I mean for three Days
Thank you all for your input! I’m going with the 4% rule. If I run out I guess i’ll be selling pickles and Candybars lol…gotta stay to the end of the party. … I’m gonna just smile my way through it.
I use to be in retail and i did dog show selling t shirt and they use to said about 2% will buy what ever you are selling but that was in the 70 so 4% sound right for now in 2010.But remenber you couldn’t see what you don’t have and a lost sale is lost money that you can reclope
0n 2 or 3 occasions, I was not prepared for the overwhelming business I was doing, and had no viable back up plan for getting more product. I now bring substantially more than my projection, and since everything is on ice, whatever doesn’t sell will sell next time I go out.
At our upcoming Festival International, I bring more than what I project as likely, and take into consideration parking as close as possible, but not too close, as me and my truck will not be able to get out. And when I return with the supplies, I will probably have to park farther away, so I may have to lug the stuff on my dolly a block or so.
I must be getting better at this, as yesterdays 2 events I did, I had only a dog or 2 left over after all the sales were over. Sold 200 dogs to families and kids at the noon concert in the park, then to the bar hopping college students, 400 more between 10 pm and 3 in the morning. Non-stop sales. Kept my assistant busy. Recuperating today!
Hi guys, sorry I haven’t been around in a few, i’ve been tied up trying to sell my company. I love being a dogger, but this buyer is making a good offer…
so i’m a little distracted… What are we talking about here?
If anyone is looking for a good deal on reusable ice packs, You might check these out.
http://www.icepackstore.com/
Thanks Jim I ordered the ice packs. We are getting ready for St Pats parade 1st event we just started last week.Thank God for this web site I am learning quickly. Rhonda
Hi Guys!
I have been watching with great interest the comments about events. My husband and I put our cart on the road a week ago. The weekend of May 22, we have a big event. We are terrified. The event planners say 15,000 – 50,000 or possibly more. We thought about setting up with a burner using a huge pot to cook hundreds of dogs at a time. My cart, being the inspected part, has to be there, but it sure can’t keep up to that kind of crowd. Thinking of chafing pots, sterno – Don’t know how much to bring – don’t know how to bring it – how much ice…I’m just a mess over this…
My first big event last year. I did use an external burner and cooked 50-75 dogs at a time then transfered to steam table, use chafing containers to hold condiments.2 servers, 1 preper and lots of money coming in. Don’t be afraid, just keep that SMILE on your face. no FROWNS!!! 🙁 Be yourself) people will love you and your dogs!
Pre-cook your hot dogs and place them in plastic bags in large ice chest or insulated containers. place in hot water before serving, decide on your budget and make cash. Also seek partnership with this event?
Thanks jim I just ordered some,have you tried them yet?
Hey Teri … sounds like you have a challenge ahead of you. If I might suggest, you should probably, very politely, go around the event planner and try to find someone within the event coordination committee that can give you some realistic numbers, possibly the chairman. Based on an estimate of 15k to 50k + tells me that this is either a first time event or a planner who simply doesn’t have the facts. Once you have some “good” numbers to work with you can then use a backwards planning process … determine how many meals you can reasonably expect to sell (4% rule may work), then determine your product needs, consumable needs, prep time for your product, storage needs based on the volume of product you’re bringing in, etc. … and of course, how many people will it take to dish up that many meals during peak periods. Assuming you haven’t done so, create yourself a spreadsheet that details every aspect of what you are doing … right down to the box count on a case of drinking straws and the number of napkins in a pack. With that spreadsheet you’ll know exactly what you need to bring and how much space it will take … and somewhere within that spreadsheet you can plug in a factor that will determine what your staffing level should be … and this is turning into a book so I’ll simply say GOOD LUCK and simply take it one step at a time.
Hi…..All of your comments are very helpful for me. I myself have my first event coming up in May, expected people 15,000. I’m figuring on going with the 4% rule like most of you say. But, have another question about the best way to sell your dogs at an event. Would you all suggest selling by the combo hot dog, chips and soda? Or selling everything individually? And, how much would you all suggest selling the items for being it a festival? Also, do you just keep it simple with hot dogs, chips and soda’s, and your usual condiments like ketchup, mustard, relish etc: Or do you all suggest also having chili, kraut etc: to top your dog? Should I also offer a sausage or kielbasa? Please, Please can anyone help me? Thanks!
This is my concern also
If this is your first big event. KEEP IT SIMPLE. I did my first year. Makes life alot easier. The next year you can add more.
Marge
Roger,
Thank you. You cut this down to “manageable.” I will take this advice and run with it!
Teri
dba Bruter Hot Dogs
Hi Roger, I just finished doing the 2010 olympics In Vancouver B.C. Canada. This was my first event.I Had 2 carts running for the duration.
Before I started the advice i was given was whatever the promoter says for attendance, half will show. 20% will buy split that # by the amount of venders.
What I learned @ the olympics is do not run out of product. I had a spare 2000 sausage stored in a freezer @ a busness beside my cart. Product is cheap and doesnt go bad if you look after it. I never ran out that wouldnt be good. As for helpers the operator on my second cart had lined up 3 – 5 helpers including herself. After the first day she went down to one and herself.
I have a very efficiant cart and was doing up to 800 dogs a day by myself. most carts had 1- 3 people though.
Kevin
all packed and ready to go have enough for 500. have time to buy for second day if need be…here goes wish me luck will post in 3 days. Just smile and feed the crew……
Packed for 600 derved alittle over 400…What do do with 200 left over buns…had a great time weather was perfect…had to do some inprovising my water tank on my cart sprung a leak as I watched 7 gallons of water dump on the ground infront of the food inspector and flooded my burmer section…What a great guy he was…he just laghed helped me clean it up and we made a makeshift hand wash..Thank god he was an old hotdogger. A big sheepish smile got me a long way…. I dont think there was anywhere close to 15-20000 people there as the promoter said was more like 7-8000. So I believe the 4% rule flys! Thanks! buns…what do I do with all these buns 2 weeks to next event.
Nature, first of all what type of buns, second of all do you serve any type of soup? if so you could use left over buns going bad as a thickner for your soups. Just get an emersion blender and have at it. Your soup should go farther and you will not have wasted left over buns. just an opinion. Hope it helps
Interesting.
Left-over buns make a great “bread pudding” extra for those sweet tooth’s.
Rob, that event was Bike Week
Nature so how was it over all? Was it like you thought except for 200 left over?I havent done a big event yet.
It was great. I’m an old lady so my feet hurt and the long day was a killer but I slept in and feel better now. I took 2 extra girls and only needed one. It was fun. The best thing about being a vendor is the people at your booth are there because they want to be. Everyone has a smile. As with every trip I learned new things and that I always over pack.lol I’m prepared for the troops. one weekend off then i’m busy for the summer every weekend. I put all my info into quickbooks and figured what I actually made and what I spent.. It came out to about 45.00 and hour not bad since I overbought for the next event ( sams club is over 100 miles away) all I will need is buns and fresh produce for my dogs. This is fun beats sitting in an office! But ask me that when the winds get to 40mph this spring. The hardest part is unloading and loading the trailer. The best part is counting the money at the end of the day and all the great folks you meet.
Here are my numbers from last weekends annual Hash Bash in Ann Arbor MI.
Expected crowd was 10,000. I took 450 Hot Dogs and 32 Veggie Brats. I sold 325 Hot Dogs and 5 Veggie and the police estimated the crowd at 5000.
I used the 4% rule and ended up at 6.5% of the crowd estimate. Either way I was covered. There was another hot dog vendor in the area, and there are dozens of resturants / fast food / coffee shops in 3-4 blocks of the event.
I think I did fairly well. Can’t wait till next year.
Hey Guys I have a road side spot for a pedestrian event that typically draws approx 333,000 over 5 days. (Brimfield Antique Show) I havent even ordered my cart yet and this will be my first event. Where do I start? Ted the Roofer
Hey Ted,
If you’ve never done this before you need to get my Hot Dog Biz 101 course. You’ll learn more in that course than you would in a month of frustrating and expensive trial and error on the job.
You can get it along with all my other training products at www.HotDogProfitsPremium.com
-Steve
What a great site!! I am going to my first event in a few days and will be selling bloomin’ onions and mexican food – we sell all kinds of stuff but this is what the event co-ordinator needed. Question, does the 4% rule still apply?
Many thanks!!
Hello everyone, great discussion forum. Here’s a question for everybody. Starting Feb 18th in Mobile, AL is Mardi Gras. It’s a 14 day festival leading up to Ash Wednesday. Last years estimate was 835,000 people. There will be a total of 34 parades and I will be set up at a secured location where each of the 34 parades pass by. If I divide the 835,000 by 10, then I should have around 83,500 people in my vacinity. If I use the 4% rule, I should expect to sell about 3,340 hot dogs + soda & chips. The reason I divided by 10 is because the parade route covers 3 miles from start to finish. Does this formular make since? BTW, I do have experience in the food service industry but, only with a brick and morter restaurant.
Hey Bob,
I think that’s as good a guesstimate as you can make. After you finish the gig you will be better able to plan for next year. Keep good notes. You won’t be able to manage pen and paper while you’re slingin’ dogs – but a pocket voice recorder works great for this. Just whip it out and talk whenever you think of something, then go over your recording a few days later and write down the important stuff.
-Steve
Steve, thanks for the feedback about Mardi Gras. Here’s another question, in downtown Mobile there is only one other hot dog vendor. She is located in front of the Government plaza building. I have been tracking her for several weeks and, she is not consistant. Even here in the deep south we do experience cold days. However, she will not operate on cold days, rainy days or, days when her child has a school function. She only works the cart to suppliment the household income (nothing wrong with that) but, I’m in it for a full time income and, will be working each and every day, good, bad or, indifferent. She has maybe the prime location downtown. Do you or anybody else reading this think she can claim the location exclusive even though she is a fair weather vendor? I don’t want to be considered “That Guy” trying to claim her spot but, lets face facts, she really is not relible for customers. The last census stated 200,000 people live in the city limits and 500,000 in the county. Mobile does have a good central business district and there are other good potential locations downtown. I would appreciate everybody’s feed back.
Bobby
Hey Bob, in the town where I live. There is a vendor who has had his cart on the same corner for the past 30 years. You have to summit your application to the city first but be prepared for a negative answer. Usually the one who has been there in prior years gets the spot. I got lucky and got my spot because the guy who had it in years past made alot of mistakes and was grumpy. He really ticked off the city so he lost. It really doesn’t matter if you are there every day, the city doesn’t care, they just don’t want any complaints about you or your cart. Check it out.
What if you are the only vendor? We are thinking of setting up at the soccer fields every Saturday during games and there are no other vendors. What % of the people in attendance would be a safe bet?
This forum is awesome and the topic/s discussed here have been very helpful and insightful, even tho hubby and I haven’t even started our hot dog biz, yet! lol
I’ve been trying to talk my hubby into something “for us” albeit he has a stubborn, paycheck mentality. This biz has been the first one I’ve spoken to him about that he seems a little interested in! I’ve been in biz for myself for over 11 yrs. in a brick & mortar business (I’m a massage practitioner) and I can tell you it takes a lot longer to earn the dollars you folks do – and is MUCH more involved work. I’m anxious to get going with this, even if I have to spearhead it myself!
I’ll start with buying your hotdog101 training book, Steve and go from there. I’ve previewed your E-Z cart site and we’ll be making our own when we purchase your plans. Unfortunately, we must do a little at a time (financial reasons)…but I’ve no doubt we’ll be successful.
By the way, since the discussion isn’t covering my little 2 cents of gabble (lol) i’ll just let you know that when I do an event with chair massage, the 4% rule is STILL a great rule of thumb to apply. If an event I’m involved with has an estimated 2,000 participants (like the golf invitational I’m about to do in July which includes golfers, their families and friends), I generally use 4% as my guideline as to how many chair massages I and my colleagues will be doing.
Awesome blog, Steve.
Can’t wait to log in and share at a later date after hubby and I (or maybe just me and my daughters) become hot-doggers!!!!!
Allyson,
Much success to you. I, too, did chair massage for many years in the Chicagoland area. My wife and I took an early retirement and moved to a small Kentucky town. Trust me. You will NOT go wrong slinging dogs. And yes…you will make way more money than standing on your feet behind a massage chair. I know. I did it!
Papa George
Good for you Papa!
Awesome Allyson! Let me know how I can help you!
-Steve
Steve
I have been selling novelty toys at fairs and festivals for sixteen years and hope to have my cart finished for next spring. The 4% rule seems very realistic. The promoters always lie is a very good statement for the new people. Mostly they say what they hope to have not real numbers.Talking to other vendors helps also not all of them consider you competition. Also do what you can afford rule is a good one my lite up swords generally sell out but i only buy what i can afford. This is a very good topic i have been wondering how food vendors do this and now i have a good idea. Thanks steve this is a great site.
A couple notes about large events, bring at least two helpers, one may have to make a Sams Club run. Plan for success bring a lot of product, even at 3 bucks you will be the least expensive food item on concession row. Set up condiment stands, buy pre-diced onions, use gallon mustard and ketchup dispensers with pumps. Swallow your artistic pride, mustard, ketchup, relish, onions only. Pre-freeze hotdogs that you wont sell within the first 6 hours of the event for food safety reasons. Set up a propane turkey fryer with water and and boil 200 or so if your event calls for it. If your buns are packaged like mine in 16 count packages; a pre=event trick is to take the buns out, separate and open them, put each bun in a hot dog boat, put them back in the package and twist tie. This can be a big time saver. Bring a towel, have a fan handy, do not sweat all over your product. Have carry trays available for large orders. Buy a napkin dispenser. Keep a smile and look in control. If you have to wait for product to finish boiling, grilling, or steaming your losing huge money. Product must be ready, Designate a cashier, prep/condiment person, dog slinger, Ive sold as many as 3500 dogs in a single all day event using this method. Best of Luck. PC
Hey Patrick, you have spot on ideas, and I really appreciate them. In Sept, 2012 I will be doing my first festival event and your ideas are really fantastic. Thank you for posting, it really helped me.
QUESTION ON EVENTS: Tons of experience talking here I’m not even started yet just getting my feet wet. What I have heard talking to other vendors though is large events often charge up front fees before you even set up your cart. Hey not even near ready for that kind of event but my question how much should I pay, should I pay at all or is this a marketing rip off.
I heard some woman say she paid $1000 sometimes $1500 up front to organizers but she insisted that merely guaranteed she would easily recoup the entrey fee and make a lot more bank besides. My question to you veteran vendors are up front event fees commonly encountered (possibly a good thing) or are up front organizer fees blatant exploitation of the unwary? Thanks to Steve, this thread is an invaluable source to a newbie wanting to avoid common the pit falls. Patrick C EXCELLENT post regarding prep tricks, cleanliness, dispensers and the turkey broiler I copied and pasted for further review 🙂
Thank you guys best of luck to all, Rich.
I think pretty much every festival wants up-front fees paid. Thats business.
Rick, 99% of all events I go to require up-front money. Some events I pay a year in advance. I`ve been doing this for 11 years now, it takes a while to get to know which events to keep, and those to dump. Don`t always believe promoters and their attendance numbers, when three people are standing in front of them, they see 7. Get to know your fellow vendors, they can help you immesely.
If you’re like me, the transaction takes longer than doing the food up. I spent two days having my transactions timed loosely with a watch and wound up with 1.2 min per transaction. Add to that necessary restocking times and potty breaks and you have how many items you can sell in an hour. This seems to be the key number. Having 49888 hot dogs with you and a like number of folks that want to buy them is meaningless if you can only process 40 orders an hour.
Cost of the Dog?
Kine of Dog?
N-C 7
Cost $ 4.25 LBS
Other All Beef Are 2.95 LBS,
What are you Hot Dog Vender Paying For Dog;S
How much to pay for dogz
per lbs,
I just did a simple local xmas event, expected 1000 people like last year, estimates were that 2000+ arrived.
Sold out 1 hour before the end of the event, so I could have taken more, but it was a bigger risk of course.
A big factor was the weather, it was dry & cool, previous years wet & windy.
If I do the event again I will look to have a different setup, one where I have everything ready & another where the dogs are brought up to temp, in batches where I dont risk big losses or risk losing big sales.
Does the 4% rule apply to general selling. For example selling at a factory?
It’s mostly for festivals.
Well I,m doing the Sturgis, SD motorcycle rally. I work all summer here but the rally is a whole different ball game. There are 500,000 people that come here and there are alot of vendors. I do know that I am the only one who sells Nathan’s hot dogs. I know this because I have been at this rally for 7 years. I have a prime location on the corner where there is a bar and restaurant. THOUSANDS of people will be passing this cart durning the day and a slammer from 11pm-2:30AM. How the heck do you figure out this one??
Thanks CC
Well, that is a lot of info to digest. We did a donation event at our local Center and it was really a hit. We felt like we just want ed to “give back” for all that has been done for us. made no money in this one, but hope to make up for it at our Saturday market this coming weekend. Question: Do all of you keep your buns in the bags and get them out as you need them to warm, or keep them in a container of some sort? We are trying to just keep it simple, but there seems to be so much “stuff” that you need and looks cluttered, I don’t like that! Thanks for this input, my husband and i are new at this so it is a learning experience.
Hey Jeanie,
Charity gigs can be a great way to generate future business. Be sure to have fliers to hand out while you are working the event. I keep my buns in the bags, or boxes when I buy them in bulk. Clutter is always a problem. You are right to try to have an uncluttered appearance. It makes your operation look clean. Glad to help!
Even though I have been in the restaurant buisness for almsot 25 years, this is something I will be an extreme noob at if I decide to take it up. I’m getting the jist of the 4%. BUT! What are your carts running on? Electric, gas? Which one’s more efficient? If gas, how many tanks should you bring, and how do you calculate the usage of it? Do you have to pay for the electric usage or is that included in your festival or fair fee? Wahdo for any help
Soulfully
John G.
Almost all of us doggers use propane fueled carts. I always bring two tanks, when one goes empty just hook up the spare. A tank can last several days to a few weeks depending on usage. If you’ve never done this before. go here to learn how to start a hot dog business.
Thanks for the fast reply. I couldnt get the link to work, stoopid puter. Anywho, with gas prices the way they are today how much of a factor is it playing in your overall profit consumption? I take it, its according to how far you travel and how much you actually bring in from the event. Condiment wise, do you add the condiments to teh dogs or do you let the customers help themselves, and if so then how far do you let the customer go as far as “Helping Themselves” goes. Sorry for the curiosity, my last name isn’t George for nothing X)
Soulfully
John G
What i meant by “gas” is vehicle gas
Got it.
Hey George,
I just use the standard mileage deduction for my tow vehicle when I’m using it for work. Right now it’s 55 and a half cents per mile. I add the condiments myself unless I’m doing a massive event where it would slow me down too much. When they help themselves they only get ketchup (gasp!), mustard, relish, or onion.
Thanks tons Steve!
You’re welcome John.
Great thread…I don’t sell hotdogs but tamales and Taco’s..the same price point..tacos 3.00/tamales 4.00 and we have our first big event this weekend..the loganberry festival on whidbey island…I had no idea the amount of food to prepare and am taking the same 4% rule. I hope it works! It’s super hard to find information on this kind of information so I appreciate the knowledge…good luck to everyone..vending!
Good luck Sheila!
Howdy,
I am starting this Saturday in front of a Lowe’s in the bay area (California) What % rule should I use
I use 4% for festivals. It might be a little different for a store front location but it will give you a good idea.
How di ya get the Lowes gig, I mean what procedures or what management did you talk to get the ok for that.. I was thinking of talking to them here is my area?
Hiya Steve, this is the best web site I have come across, everyone’s questions was everything I was thinking. I am so happy I found this site, it is so informative and I have learned so much. I really am happy I learned about the 4% rule. I will be doing my first event in Sept. and wow, this was such a releif because I had no clue as to how much food and supplies to purchase. i just wanted to thank everyone for all the ideas and tips!!! THANK YOU -THANK YOU
I’m glad you like it Ronda. I work hard at it but my readers are the secret sauce – I always say that I have the best readers on the internet!
I am going to sell hot dogs and soda at a local event said to draw around 15k people. I have no interest in making a profit and am selling the product while marketing my business. I think the 4% rule seems very logical. What do you think about soda? I am at a loss at how much to purchase.
I’m so very glad this site exists. 🙂
Ginger
Two to four percent on soda, depending on your proximity to other beverage vendors. Glad you like the site Ginger!
My Cub Scout Pack is doing a fundraising event in north jersey, only 1 other hot dog vender, but there are other foood venders. They say 15,ooo people, I have done this event with my work and it’s more like 10,000. We were going to sell $2 dogs and $1 water and soda, always get support for the scouts but, How many dogs, water, soda.
Event is mid October on a saturday 10 to 5. We don’t sell popcorn so we need to do different things. We have a SS hot dog cart to use. And all permits. Any help would be welcomed. Thank you so much. Don
Use the 4% rule as explained in the article. Good luck!
find a supermarket to work with… tell them your fundraising idea… Ask them to “protect” you on the product (the inventory) and ask them to provide the product at wholesale (1/4 to 1/2 retail)… with their “protection” you will not have to worry about being over or under, it’s “protected” and you don’t have to go back on the street the next day to sell excess meat, buns, etc…
One other thing, i recommend NOT selling hotdogs for a price… I have a large sign for fundraising events that has a picture of a hotdog in a bun and says “FREE HOTDOGS”… You take donations for your fundraising (they will be larger this way) rather than putting a price on them… Trust me… The only other thing you can do is get some school cheerleaders to hold fishbowls and approach the foot traffic… Girls are cuter and less threatening than Cub scouts… Again, trust me… Unless of course you have a MOM that’s willing to put on a bikini and wear roller-skates… Anyone who will give you $10 or $20 for a hotdog, you take a picture of them with some scouts and email it to them (from a generic account)… And the next person in lines donation will be maybe just as big… j-)
Cheerleaders are less threatening than Cub Scouts. I love it – quote of the week Tom, LOL!
Hello fellow slingers I have my first party event coming up here for the Homestead NASCAR Event I got a call to supply hot dogs and sausages and burgers for a party of 80 to 120 people what does anyone recommend just rent the cart for $350.00 and have host supply product or what should be charged for something like this. Any ideas
Thank you
Joe
If your cart is unbranded you can rent it out and let the customer use whatever product they like. If the cart has your business name and logo on it you should work it yourself and use the product you always do. You must control your brand and the quality associated with it.
I will do it that way at the car dealer… but I never let someone else run my cart… they pay me $250 for day to sling and they provide product. Never let someone else run your cart… it’s not theirs, so they don’t treat it like it’s their own… Everyone asks to borrow my cart, but no one gets, not even family…
I understand Tom. It’s your baby.
Thanks Steve I have it branded but have 2 menus so it’s attached by Velcro sign so if I do events for art shows and the other for every day has logo’s on it with menu
Nice!
I also use the 4% rule. Logistics are very important. Determine the distance from event to your supplier(s) and know their hours of operation. We have a return agreement with our supplier, such as, unopened buns, unopened supplies and condiments they will take back and give us credit.
I like the return policy. Good for you.
No big deal but the biggest thing for me is next Sunday the 4th or 5th. So far up to Friday past there are 300 registered walkers joggers for this marathon. I’m sure there will be friends and relatives and other spectators. Luckily I will be only a mile or so from the large market here.
I was told to figure 30% to 40% because I’m the only game in town for this. I was asked to do this. I will get 120 Dogs and buns to start, and I will be sure and get 30 or 40 buns in boats broken and open ahead of time. If they start to move, I’ll have my son or wife to get another start on preparing the buns ahead of time. I have a grill that does a bunch of em quick, a 1/2 size steam pan and 2 1/4 size pans that I can load up and boil them.
I like the mustard, relish, onions and ketchup idea. At my regular site 80% to 90% just want mustard and ketchup anyway just like little kids. I can hardly give away chili and slaw. This is like a different planet as far as hot dogs are concerned. Really!!
Im curious to know if it is easier to have squeeze/pump bottles of condiments or condiment packets during a large event? Is it faster or more profitable to have the packets?
The packets are expensive and create a big mess. People use them and throw the empty packets on the ground. Go with the pump bottles for large events.
I was wondering if someone could give me some advice on how to get into some events as a food vendor. I’d be selling BBQ and I’m located in Florida. Any input would be great, there’s not much on the web for advice.
Thank you in advance
Jeremiah.
I am preparing to do my first event. An event where the attendance is estimated at about 2000. There will be just one other food vendor at this event and they will be selling BBQ Sandwiches. How do I calculate how much product to take? The 4% rule doesn’t seem like it would work for this.
You can always bring extra as long as you have cold storage and a place to sell the leftover inventory in a reasonable amount of time.
We may be doing an event with about 300 people. This organization wants us to give 20% of our profit. Is that too much to give?
On the high side but I’d probably go for it if there were no other fees.
20% of profit or 20% of total sales? very big difference.
Yes, it makes a difference but a great thing about the hot dog biz is that our margins are sooooo much better than most businesses. 70% gross is not uncommon.
I am having an event and i need 1,000 hotdogs and 1,000 hamburgers…how much do you think i would be spending??
It depends on what you can get them for locally.
Steve, I haven’t bought a dog cart yet, but seriously thinking of it. So, I would like to know which is best to do at a festival, sell 1 dog, 1 bag of chips and 1 soda or 2 dogs, 1 bag of chips and 1 soda? What would you charged? Which would be more profitable?
Hi Wayne,
Profits depend on your costs and your selling price. Either one of your combos will be profitable if you price it properly. We usually shoot for a 70 percent gross profit on food and drinks but you can usually get even more than that at festivals. You could offer both combos if you want to.
Hello,
I need some advice. My church is going to do hotdogs sales at the Keene,NH pumpkin fest in October as a fundraiser. We are trying to decide how much hotdogs, buns, Carmel apples, water, … To buy for the event. There is between 50,000 and 100,000 people expected to attend this year depending on the weather. We will absolutely need enough product for 10 hours of serving. I have seen the 4% rule on here but am unsure if it works with such a big event. Any and all advice is welcome. Equipment, help, supplies, serving, things to know and expect. We have no experience at all!!!
Thank you ahead off time for your help,
Trish
Hi Trish,
Estimating is really hard, especially if you are starting with a 50% margin of error (50,000 – 100,000 people). Read through the comments on this article. They will really help you.
So I’m running concessions for an all day youth football tournament and we are the only food and drink vendor with a projected 1,500 people attending incl the 22 youth teams playing. We are offering pulled pork, burgers, dogs and fries but struggling with how much of each to have on hand. I’m only going to have 60lbs of pulled pork.
Use the 4 percent rule for total food sales and have a runner ready to get more. Hard to say which way to break it down among the different food items. Good luck!
Hi everyone, I have a question please regarding hot dog catering and how to charge.
I am struggling to get my head round the difference in charging for individual dogs and the unlimited consumption pricing. Is there a formula for working out a price for a consumption type event?
Many thanks
Nick
Hi Nick,
I prefer a per-head pricing strategy. I believe it is fair for both the vendor and the host.
Hello all, terrific tips and thanks. I’m wondering if someone can comment on how to go about getting a cart in a Walmart parking lot. Who I’d need to speak to, how much Walmart takes, and just how the experience is generally. Thanks so much.
Generally Walmart only allows charitable organizations to set up on their property. You could partner with a charity and get one day at Walmart to build awareness in the community and to collect email addresses for your list.
I am planning on a fundraiser event for a motor cycle bike rally that is expecting to bring in 300 people, plus their are the towns people in the Heber Overgaard area. I have never done an event like this before so I want to keep it simple so hot dogs came to mind. How many hot dogs should I get and what advise can you share to help me make this successful?
If you are the only vendor and all the attendees are expecting to eat hot dogs (and you have publicized the event that way), then bring 300. Otherwise, go with the tips in the article.
I just got a spot at are DMV there are 1500 to 2000 people a day walk in front of my cart to go into the DMV its 5 days a week how do I figure the amount I should start with an what percent will buy from the cart. Also the state gave me the cart an I give them 10 percent of gross sales. it made it easy they had everything done I think it a good deal as long as I can sell. Thanks from Ken
Just start small the first day. Stock one case of dogs and see how it goes. If you sell out early no big deal. That’s a good sign!
Wow! You guys are awesome. I have finished my cart and now waiting on my permit to start. I have been in contact with several event planners and they seem to be very informative. I have also found a awesome general liability insurance carrier as well. I can’t wait to operate my business and become my own boss. Good luck to everybody!!!
Good luck to you Greg!
Hi all Matt from Bubbadogz Hot Dog Company. Wow see lots of new names as well as many familiar (Pocono etc). Glad to see were growing and not shrinking.
After many years and events now stick with the 4% rule it’s pretty consistent. My advice is if you new to the big event scene set a limit and go with that until you get comfortable. Depending on the size of the event I would set a limit of 250 dogs for smaller events, and 350 for larger ones. If I sold out I’d pull up a chair and drink a beer no problem. There are so many variables any given day that it’s best to get comfortable with the process and have fun while making $$. The rest will take care of itself!
Good ideas Matt!
Steve
A week or so ago you mentioned Serving. breakfast. I think. This is a terrific. Idea but how do we cook everything on the hotdog cart?
Linda
Be creative. As long as your health department allows the foods that you want to serve, there is always a way to cook it. Griddles, a second two burner stove, crock pots, what ever you need to do.
Hello Steve & fellow readers!
I have found the best advice in the article and comments above, you guys are AWESOME!
I’m from Canada (Montreal) where I operate a store front. I will attend a local festival next week that attracts over 200 000 people each year. It’s in its 4th year running. I sell vegan food (I know y’all sell meat, it’s ok…y’all can watch the documentatiries on Netflix when you’re ready ????).
There are approximately 10 restaurants/food trucks participating, which include one vegetarian, mussels (very popular and I’m next to them, the street will separate us), tacos, bbq. I’ll be selling pressed juice, faux sausage sandwiches, Jamaican patties, baked goods.
How do I plan 4% when I have different items on the menu? My shop is 6 blocks away from the event (north).
Has anyone had a complete flop? I’m putting it all in for this event so that I can attract people to my shop.
Also, should I set up another table with products for an extra stram of revenu?
Lastly, do you pay staff for the day or per hour?
Thanks in advance!
-Loren
Use four percent as a total estimate for all your foods combined. The fact that your shop is so close means that you don’t have to worry about running out of inventory. You can have a
“runner” replenish your stock as needed. If you are trying to get publicity for your shop, you should be handing out fliers and collecting email addresses so you can re-market to these folks. I would not set up an extra table. You will have your hands full with the food. Pay your staff whatever seems fair to you. Good luck!
-Steve
Thanks good ideas! I like all the suggestions.
Our pleasure!
I have found the input regarding suggested inventory for events very helpful. I like the 4% rule.
As far as ice, we freeze different size plastic bottles full of water.
Cool! (get it?) Thanks for the great tip David!
Hey Steve,
I understand everyone’s thoughts on %-to-attendees, the number of other vendors, etc…..
For me, I learned early on, it’s not abpit how many people are there, but more about planning on what you can handle.
I know I can make 80dogs an hour! Not setting the world on fire with volume, but I prepare every single dog served (I’m not a fan of putting out the condiments so everyone just squirts away or smears an endless mess everywhere, plus, who’s to know of that little 6yo just 5minutes earlier decided to dig for gold knuckle deep in his nose)… anywho, I have a cashier who handles tendering and bagging the dogs or meals (chips/drinks/napkins, etc…), that way I can focus on the hotdog process and the customer in front of me. Plus at big events, I started having a person selling just drinks, Gatorade, bottled water at a table right next to the cart. So with three people (me, a cashier at the cart, and another person at the drinks only table) I know at a 7hr event, I’m can easily serve 560 hotdogs. Wouldn’t make since to me to prepare for 1000, if I physically can’t make but half that.
And on water – water is king, if you price it right – cost = 12cents, sell for a dollar all day. My last event in 2016, sold about 14cases(36pks), in 5hrs – my fellow vendors sold two or three cases ea, but were priced @ $2 or more a bottle. $1 is my everyday pricing (I don’t jack up pricing for events)
Hope this helps some
Mike
Great input Mike!
Great platform!
I have a hot dog & sausage catering truck in Michigan just north of Detroit.
I’ve been perfecting my system for over 15 years.
We serve 500 people hot dogs and sausage for lunch within an hour. YES we steam the buns too.
!000 people just hot dogs in an hour.
The menu options and conversation slows us down.
I shy away from retail festival events as I like to serve lunch and be home by 3pm.
One worker and I can cater a weekday lunch for 150 people from 11 to 1 and the invoice exceeds $2000.
We fill our summer catering calendar in January with our repeating clients.
Many have been with us for 5 to 10 years.
I’m 66 years old and looking for a buy in partner.
Great information, thank you.
so here is my 2 cents about the 4% rule. Did my first event a few weeks ago. A car show that drew between 3-4K. So I calculated 160, which seemed a little low to me. I brought 400 dogs and sold 130. This past weekend, I did a town festival that figured between 5-7K, depending on weather. I calculated for 7K since it was going to be nice out on Saturday. I brought 300 hot dogs and sold 520. Luckily there was a grocery store across the street. I went twice and wiped them out. Both days had good weather and good crowds. I think the only difference was the type of crowd, Older crowd at the car show and not too many families with kids. I don’t think people stayed all day. they came and saw the cars then left. The other one had fireworks at night and was more of an all day event for familes. So even though there may be a big crowd, the type of event and crowd makes a big difference.
Thanks Steve for helping me get started. 2 events under my belt so I’m still learning.
Mike
Whatup Dogs
Yeah, the 4% is definitely an estimate at best. Sounds like you are off to a great start Mike!
-Steve
Steve, does the 4% rule work now in 2021 ? I see people have out dates from years back.
Tom
Roadside Dogs
Yes, it’s pretty standard.
Your blog provides invaluable insights for everyone in the food industry catering to massive events! The detailed breakdown of how many meals to bring is incredibly useful for ensuring a successful and pleasurable experience for both caterers and guests. Thank you for sharing such sensible and informative content.